Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO !
[Re: Moparnut426]
#449450
08/12/10 12:23 AM
08/12/10 12:23 AM
|
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 1,880 USA
Ron Silva
OP
top fuel
|
OP
top fuel
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 1,880
USA
|
Definately a Girl.
Funny thing, I have static timed 1000 engines and when I got this engine running it was REALLY acting up. It wanted start hard and did not want to idle, but would run OK and rev OK and all that. I had a hard time because it would not idle. When I FINALLY was able to get the timing light on it, it was at something like 130 deg advanced. [Edited by Moparts - Family Friendly Site - Keep it clean]?? Every time I tried to back the timing down it would stall and backfire out the carb??? Totally perplexed I decided to start from scratch and static time it once again............WELL, I THEN discovered that I had two plug wires crossed, AND they happened to be the #1 and the #3....Doh! So I was timing off #3. What are the odds.
Now she just PURRS!
SRT DEMON ONE SEAT
|
|
|
Re: It's FINISHED!
[Re: GregCon]
#449453
08/12/10 01:15 AM
08/12/10 01:15 AM
|
Joined: Jun 2010
Posts: 798 Houston TX
GregCon
super stock
|
super stock
Joined: Jun 2010
Posts: 798
Houston TX
|
I have torqued lots of rod bolts and I think you are doing it the hard way.
Here's my routine, if you want it, keep reading!
1)Lube liberally all surfaces that touch any other surfaces, not just the threads, with ARP lube. It makes a difference in both torque and stretch stability values.
2) Use your dial gauge to measure length with no torque.
3) Remove the gauge, set it aside carefully.
4) Torque the bolts up to about 70 lbs in 10 lbs increments, swapping sides each time. Use a high quality 1/2 drive torque wrench.
5) Recheck length with gauge and then remove, etc, increasing torque until you get to the desired stretch.
Leaving the gauge in place and using a 2 ft long wrench is asking for misery. It's also fairly dangerous.
I know what you'll say - taking the gauge off is inviting inaccuracy. But, once you do it a few times you'll realize the gauge is stable enough it is staying accurate.
I also don't agree that you need or want previously un-stretched bolts....if you torque and loosen those bolts five times you'll find they take a 'set' and eventually settle down to a repeatable stretch. That tells me their initial stretch, if that's all you do, is going to relax after a while.
|
|
|
Re: It's FINISHED!
[Re: GregCon]
#449454
08/12/10 03:57 AM
08/12/10 03:57 AM
|
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 1,880 USA
Ron Silva
OP
top fuel
|
OP
top fuel
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 1,880
USA
|
Quote:
I have torqued lots of rod bolts and I think you are doing it the hard way.
Here's my routine, if you want it, keep reading!
1)Lube liberally all surfaces that touch any other surfaces, not just the threads, with ARP lube. It makes a difference in both torque and stretch stability values.
2) Use your dial gauge to measure length with no torque.
3) Remove the gauge, set it aside carefully.
4) Torque the bolts up to about 70 lbs in 10 lbs increments, swapping sides each time. Use a high quality 1/2 drive torque wrench.
5) Recheck length with gauge and then remove, etc, increasing torque until you get to the desired stretch.
Leaving the gauge in place and using a 2 ft long wrench is asking for misery. It's also fairly dangerous.
I know what you'll say - taking the gauge off is inviting inaccuracy. But, once you do it a few times you'll realize the gauge is stable enough it is staying accurate.
I also don't agree that you need or want previously un-stretched bolts....if you torque and loosen those bolts five times you'll find they take a 'set' and eventually settle down to a repeatable stretch. That tells me their initial stretch, if that's all you do, is going to relax after a while.
I 100% agree with you as long as you measure EACH bolt as you go. I in fact did a variation of what you say on a couple of mine. Two or 3 times I got just shy of the desired .006-.0064 and to get a small movement and get another .0002 or .0003 is extremely hard with my makeshift wrench. So I would remove the gauge and use a long breaker bar with a socket to turn the bolt another couple degrees and then remeasure.
I have no problem removing and reinstalling the gauge once or several times. It does repeat with very good results.
The PROBLEM I have is some Guys say they did one bolt your way and found that it took THAT BOLT 67 foot pounds to get the desired stretch, so they torqued them all to 67 foot pounds. There are so many variables that would not be the ideal way to do it.
To tell you the truth, all the methods above would "probably" not result in a failed fastener that often , if ever.
I only wanted new Bolts because of what was told to me by Ryan about those specific type bolts.
PS: I do not mind working hard and doing it the hard way if I feel it is the most accurate. That is why I do it the way I do. I watch every bolt stretch as it is happening and it is a struggle, but eliminates all the variables.
SRT DEMON ONE SEAT
|
|
|
Re: It's FINISHED!
[Re: blown572dart]
#449460
08/12/10 11:14 AM
08/12/10 11:14 AM
|
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 1,880 USA
Ron Silva
OP
top fuel
|
OP
top fuel
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 1,880
USA
|
I wanted to give my first impressions of the new motor. One of the reasons I did not realize I had the #1 and #3 plug wires crossed is because it started right up and I EXPECTED a radical idle based on the cam specs. I was a little peeved when I first saw the cam specs because I did not really want a radical idle. Now I am glad I did not say anything, so I did not have to eat any crow.
Well, this motor is quieter AND smoother than the 406 crate motor. The carb is all messed up because I had the plug wires crossed and was cranking on it to get it to idle. But once I get it dialed, I expect this engine to idle surprisingly smooth. Once I static timed it the second time , it ended up being dead nuts on 35 deg timing so I left it there, but once I switch it to the crank trigger I will probably set it at 32 and call it good. LOL
The valvetrain is quiet and I am pretty happy about that. Can you say 9.90's with a hydraulic cam! Woohoo!
I only drove it over to Sloan's house yesterday (about 1 mile) and then about 5 more miles and I was taking it easy. The Rod bearing clearances were just a hair tighter than I like so I did not want to stand on it right away even though I know it is probably better for the rings. It drives quite a bit like the crate motor (which is also a hydraulic roller cam), moves away from a light a little easier, seems to really want to wake up if you goose the throttle. Right now I have the Race Demon RS Carb on it straight off the crate motor, BUT I have a brand new Quick Fuel Technology, Race Q 950 to go on it when I get around to it. I also have to make a new set of plug wires because of the taller Valve Covers. I was not expecting that and a couple of those wires are TIGHT going over the VV covers.
ALSO, UGH, I have to change the trans before I race it. Dave did not have any billet input shafts when he built this trans for me and so I will have to do something about that before I hit the track. He has my spare right now and I am going to light a fire under him to get it back. It's just as well, because I will be pulling the headers to get them coated and can do it then.
SRT DEMON ONE SEAT
|
|
|
Re: It's FINISHED!
[Re: Ron Silva]
#449463
08/12/10 12:26 PM
08/12/10 12:26 PM
|
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 8,547 State College, PA
RyanJ
moparts member
|
moparts member
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 8,547
State College, PA
|
Quote:
I wanted to give my first impressions of the new motor. One of the reasons I did not realize I had the #1 and #3 plug wires crossed is because it started right up and I EXPECTED a radical idle based on the cam specs. I was a little peeved when I first saw the cam specs because I did not really want a radical idle. Now I am glad I did not say anything, so I did not have to eat any crow.
Well, this motor is quieter AND smoother than the 406 crate motor.
LOL it's FIVE HUNDRED inches... what may look like a radical cam in a 340/360 or even a 416 4" crank motor is tame in a 500. I'm glad the lifters are not too noisy... I've had hyd rollers before that can be obnoxious, looks like Glenn got them right.
|
|
|
Re: ONE DOWN , ONE TO GO !
[Re: Ron Silva]
#449464
08/12/10 01:53 PM
08/12/10 01:53 PM
|
Joined: Dec 2009
Posts: 242 Upland, California
Spode
enthusiast
|
enthusiast
Joined: Dec 2009
Posts: 242
Upland, California
|
Quote:
Engine was born at 4:30 PM California time today.
I think I heard the fire up all the way at my house
Congrats great project and thanks for the detailed thread.
|
|
|
|
|